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ck
Pridružen/-a: Pon Feb 2009 19:27 Prispevkov: 1605 Kraj: kamnik
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Objavljeno: Pon Apr 17, 2017 09:57 Naslov sporočila: |
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Za vsak sluaèaj èe koga zanese.
_________________ LP |
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nek_do
Pridružen/-a: Čet Okt 2009 21:22 Prispevkov: 2276 Kraj: Ljubljana
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Objavljeno: Pon Apr 17, 2017 10:55 Naslov sporočila: |
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Ampak se vse oprosti, ker je splošno znano, da................
_________________ Lep je dan |
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Vinylfreak86
Pridružen/-a: Pon Okt 2013 21:57 Prispevkov: 298 Kraj: Celje
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Objavljeno: Pon Apr 17, 2017 18:01 Naslov sporočila: |
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Zadaj pa Pioneerjev "direct-driver" iz sedemdesetih let. _________________ Vinyl forever!!! |
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magician
Pridružen/-a: Čet Jan 2017 22:12 Prispevkov: 6 Kraj: Ljubljana
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Objavljeno: Tor Apr 18, 2017 20:09 Naslov sporočila: |
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Pozdravljeni vsi, evo moj prvi post. Tole zadaj je Marantz 6100, ga vsak dan gledam/poslušam |
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ambasador
Pridružen/-a: Sre Feb 2011 19:52 Prispevkov: 5984 Kraj: Izola
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Vinylfreak86
Pridružen/-a: Pon Okt 2013 21:57 Prispevkov: 298 Kraj: Celje
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Objavljeno: Sre Apr 19, 2017 14:26 Naslov sporočila: |
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magician je napisal/a: | Pozdravljeni vsi, evo moj prvi post. Tole zadaj je Marantz 6100, ga vsak dan gledam/poslušam |
Ok, dizajn je podoben Pioneerjevim DD iz sedemdesetih, sam sem se sedaj spomnil, da tisti original niso bili nikoli v barvi lesa, ampak pobarvani sivo. Ohišje je bilo iz iverke. Si jih je pa veliko ljudi predelalo, da so sedaj v barvi lesa. Drugaèe pa sam raje gledam ženske kot gramofon. _________________ Vinyl forever!!! |
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before
Pridružen/-a: Pon Maj 2008 19:23 Prispevkov: 2796 Kraj: Ruše
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Objavljeno: Sre Apr 19, 2017 14:45 Naslov sporočila: |
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Vinylfreak86 je napisal/a: | Drugaèe pa sam raje gledam ženske kot gramofon. |
Kar se tièe poslušanja pa je ravno obratno! Še posebej èe gre za vintage...
Moje besede... _________________ Cenite to kar imate in stremite k boljšemu! To je moj recept za zadovoljstvo.
Audiohedonist |
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Vinylfreak86
Pridružen/-a: Pon Okt 2013 21:57 Prispevkov: 298 Kraj: Celje
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Objavljeno: Čet Apr 20, 2017 00:20 Naslov sporočila: |
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before je napisal/a: | Vinylfreak86 je napisal/a: | Drugaèe pa sam raje gledam ženske kot gramofon. |
Kar se tièe poslušanja pa je ravno obratno! Še posebej èe gre za vintage...
Moje besede... |
Hja no, dekleta rojena konec 70. so še vedno za pogledat, èe le imajo vredu gene in pazijo nase. Drugaèe pa ne vem, èe je Marantz sploh kdaj sam izdeloval gramofone, trenutno jih za njih izdeluje Clearaudio, v preteklosti so to bili verjetno japonski izdelovalci. Bilo je nekaj japonskih izdelovalcev, ki so tako kot danes to poèneta Yahorng in Hanpin, izdelovali gramofone za druge znamke. _________________ Vinyl forever!!! |
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ambasador
Pridružen/-a: Sre Feb 2011 19:52 Prispevkov: 5984 Kraj: Izola
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Objavljeno: Čet Apr 20, 2017 17:34 Naslov sporočila: |
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Poglej si tega lepotca: Marantz Esotec TT 1000
http://801a-4242a.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2013-12-29
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/416794140492395757/
Ĺ e direct drive je. Uporabili so kaljeno steklo, ne pleksi.
Marantz cenene serije verjetno res ni izdeloval v lastni hiši, top modele pa ja.
Glavni japonski proizvajalci kot so Pioneer, Technics, Sony, Sansui, Sanyo, Kenwood, Hitachi, so si kar sami izdelovali glavnino. Res pa so koristili veliko standardnih delov od terciarnih proizvajalcev kot je Jelco, Mitachi.. (shell, lift, protiutež, cevka roèice, nekateri tudi motorje, nogice itd). Vsega se ni splaèalo razvijati, ekonomija vabi. Tudi ni tako preprosto to nagruntati, da je cenovno optimalno ob sprejemljivem zvoku. _________________ Carpe Diem |
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ambasador
Pridružen/-a: Sre Feb 2011 19:52 Prispevkov: 5984 Kraj: Izola
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Objavljeno: Pon Feb 05, 2018 11:11 Naslov sporočila: |
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Iz zadnjega Audioreview.it:
Iz Technicsa so želeli pri njih narediti predstavitev DD modela SL-1000R (še ni definitivna verzija, v teku so testiranja po svetu, bili so tudi pri Fremerju/Analog Planet/ obstaja zapis na internetu)) in zahtevali prisotnost Marca Benedettija. Potem so se pa dogovorili za predstavitev kar pri njemu doma.
Prišli so Masayuki Shiwa (šef razvoja), Tetsuya Itani (vodja projekta gramofona) in zastopnik Panasonic-a za Italijo in seveda glavni urednik revije.
Benedetti je zapisal, da je ostal brez sline.. ko je slišal skladbo Donna Lee (Pastorius) tako precizno odigrane bass rife, ki jih je dotedaj slišal samo iz 927 EMT-ja.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdqje73KQwg
Iz jermenarjev pride dol bas zvok bolj podoben marmeladi kot konsistenca in kako se bas note prekrivajo in mažejo, èe uporabim njegove (slikovito pretirane) besede. Gre za preciznost kontrole basa ki je šibka toèka jermenov, predvsem elastiènih. Ma tudi DD z nizkim navorom (Bardo naprimer) se obnaša podobno.
Njegova ocena je, da je novi 1200G (3.500€) prešišal SP10MKll, SL-1000R (15.000€) pa deklasiral SP10Mklll (oboje ima doma). Šokirala jih je dinamika, bliskovitost tranzientov, velikost scene in neverjetna kolièina informacij,detajlov.
Japonci so obèudovali njegovo kolekcijo vrhunskih odjemnih doz, menda ima skoraj vse kar se da kupiti, na koncu pa so še podrobno popisali vse detajle iz njegovega stereo sistema do vkljuèno uporabljenih elektronk.
Benedetti pravi da je 1000R zvoèno popolnoma na njegovi liniji dojemanja kako mora gramofon igrati in da je prviè slišal nekaj kar je zamajalo njegov EMT. Edina pripomba je letela èez roèico, ker se je ponovila ista izkušnja - dinamièno balansirane roèice so po njegovem mnenju superione v kontroli basa napram statièno balansiranim. On uporablja FR-66 -12 inèno verzijo.
Slike iz tega eventa:
https://tech4u.it/18951-technics-sl-1000r-giradischi-hi-end-base-sp-10r/
Nova legenda je rojena.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ta tema, odprta pred toèno tremi leti ima vprašaj v naslovu. Sedaj ni veè vprašaja, DD prevzema primat. Ne tisti stari DD ampak novi, podkrepljen z modernimi prijemi, spoznanji in tehnologijo.
Lahko se odpre novo temo - bo (jermenski) imperij vrnil udarec? _________________ Carpe Diem |
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habo66
Pridružen/-a: Čet Maj 2010 18:01 Prispevkov: 1080 Kraj: Lenart
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fjaka
Pridružen/-a: Sre Maj 2008 17:04 Prispevkov: 1747 Kraj: Ljubljana
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Objavljeno: Čet Avg 16, 2018 00:55 Naslov sporočila: |
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oboĹľujem ZF "internetna" nakladanja....
samo za "tvoje" oèi...orgigigi Marantz v lesu....èe hoèeš sivega, ki je bolj redek, dobiš....
juhuhuuuuuuuuuu
P.S. fotka je avtorska.... _________________ šoo mazgoon |
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fjaka
Pridružen/-a: Sre Maj 2008 17:04 Prispevkov: 1747 Kraj: Ljubljana
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Objavljeno: Čet Avg 16, 2018 01:11 Naslov sporočila: |
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ambasador je napisal/a: |
Benedetti je zapisal, da je ostal brez sline.. ko je slišal skladbo Donna Lee (Pastorius) tako precizno odigrane bass rife, ki jih je dotedaj slišal samo iz 927 EMT-ja.
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zanimivo....dlje èasa je pokojni, boljše igra....
basisti še danes raziskujejo kaj je naredil iz yebenega Jazzbassa in Acoustica...Benedetti je doživel extazo....jupiiiiiiiiiii...... _________________ šoo mazgoon |
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canyonn
Pridružen/-a: Pon Apr 2009 15:53 Prispevkov: 640 Kraj: kanal
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Objavljeno: Čet Avg 16, 2018 08:26 Naslov sporočila: |
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ambasador je napisal/a: | Iz zadnjega Audioreview.it:
Iz Technicsa so želeli pri njih narediti predstavitev DD modela SL-1000R (še ni definitivna verzija, v teku so testiranja po svetu, bili so tudi pri Fremerju/Analog Planet/ obstaja zapis na internetu)) in zahtevali prisotnost Marca Benedettija. Potem so se pa dogovorili za predstavitev kar pri njemu doma.
Prišli so Masayuki Shiwa (šef razvoja), Tetsuya Itani (vodja projekta gramofona) in zastopnik Panasonic-a za Italijo in seveda glavni urednik revije.
Benedetti je zapisal, da je ostal brez sline.. ko je slišal skladbo Donna Lee (Pastorius) tako precizno odigrane bass rife, ki jih je dotedaj slišal samo iz 927 EMT-ja.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdqje73KQwg
Iz jermenarjev pride dol bas zvok bolj podoben marmeladi kot konsistenca in kako se bas note prekrivajo in mažejo, èe uporabim njegove (slikovito pretirane) besede. Gre za preciznost kontrole basa ki je šibka toèka jermenov, predvsem elastiènih. Ma tudi DD z nizkim navorom (Bardo naprimer) se obnaša podobno.
Njegova ocena je, da je novi 1200G (3.500€) prešišal SP10MKll, SL-1000R (15.000€) pa deklasiral SP10Mklll (oboje ima doma). Šokirala jih je dinamika, bliskovitost tranzientov, velikost scene in neverjetna kolièina informacij,detajlov.
Japonci so obèudovali njegovo kolekcijo vrhunskih odjemnih doz, menda ima skoraj vse kar se da kupiti, na koncu pa so še podrobno popisali vse detajle iz njegovega stereo sistema do vkljuèno uporabljenih elektronk.
Benedetti pravi da je 1000R zvoèno popolnoma na njegovi liniji dojemanja kako mora gramofon igrati in da je prviè slišal nekaj kar je zamajalo njegov EMT. Edina pripomba je letela èez roèico, ker se je ponovila ista izkušnja - dinamièno balansirane roèice so po njegovem mnenju superione v kontroli basa napram statièno balansiranim. On uporablja FR-66 -12 inèno verzijo.
Slike iz tega eventa:
https://tech4u.it/18951-technics-sl-1000r-giradischi-hi-end-base-sp-10r/
Nova legenda je rojena.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ta tema, odprta pred toèno tremi leti ima vprašaj v naslovu. Sedaj ni veè vprašaja, DD prevzema primat. Ne tisti stari DD ampak novi, podkrepljen z modernimi prijemi, spoznanji in tehnologijo.
Lahko se odpre novo temo - bo (jermenski) imperij vrnil udarec? |
Na audiogonu pa malo drugaèe zdej komu verjet ?
Technics Sp10 Mk2 vs SL-1200G - I finally did an A/B
Guys, it is payback time. I have asked so many questions here to improve my knowledge or make a good purchase. I should give back now.
This is a topic that is HOT these days. Are the new generation Technics 1200G/GAE and Sp10-R better than the vintage Sp10 Mk2 and Mk3 ?
I have myself asked this question multiple times here. The most common reply was a resounding "Yes" in favour of the new 1200G/GAE. The 10R is still too new and not many have a direct opinion. But in general, even those who have commented on the 1200G vs Sp10 mk2, almost no one has compared them side by side. Some have written based on aural memory, some based on specs and design, and some have written based on pure subjective opinion.
In any case, most of us are very happy that Technics has done it. A very few business oriented minds might be disappointed that their business around vintage Technics DDs would take some hit due to these modern machines.
Since I was in the market for a good high resolution TT to replace my modded Loricraft Garrard 301, I took active interest in the Technics DDs. Overall I was convinced that the 1200G is the machine to look out for. It was clearly favored over the smaller sp10 and more or less compared to the bigger sp10 mk3. I got a brand new 1200G and sent it to Time-Step audio for their Evoke PSU mod. It is a very well accepted mod in the UK markets. In general the Switch-Mode PSU of the 1200G is considered its Achilles heel so this mod was a necessity.
I finally had the 1200G at my home. I won't go into the process of setting up as it was a simple and straight forward one. I used its own Technics tonearm to start with. I tried couple of platter mats but its own default mat sounded fine so it remained. I have 2 cartridges to play, the Denon 103r and Ortofon Cadenza blue. None of them are esoteric stuff, but I find them very neutral and musically "right" sounding carts.
Straightaway the 1200G revealed that it was a more transparent and higher resolution player than the Garrard. The noise floor was lower, inner details more easily heard. Soundstage more precise and layered. Great! There was an extra sparkle to the sound which was quite thrilling. More like going from HD to UHD. What felt a bit lacking was overall dynamics and scale. The 1200G sounded "Compact". The Garrard was like a full blown full scale sound. I let the 1200G run at 78rpm for many hours so that the burn-in process is expedited. I also tried both the auto and manual servo settings to vary the torque and balance of the sound. As I listened more I also realized that the 1200G does not have the fluidity that I am used to with the Garrard or other belt drive TTs I have heard. Notes bloom but die out instantly, followed by a silence before the next note. Something that joins the notes so that it all sounds related was missing a bit. In terms of dynamics, the intensity of an "explosion or a shout" was kind of controlled. That takes away a bit of that startle factor which allows us to get awestruck with our systems. Bass on the 1200G sounded a bit chopped. It did not feel very deep and powerful. I rather felt I am listening to mid-upper bass with average impact. But when it came to details it sounded like a super Cd player in a good way.
I decided to play with the tonearm at this point. I have a 47 Labs RS-A1 tonearm which has its own standing mount. One can just lift it and place it at the right distance so that the under-hang is correct and you are good to go. It is a musical tonearm. Once installed, this tonearm gave the Technics a significant jump on the performance. Especially it made the Technics sound less hifi and more musical, more fluid, more jump factor. Just plain more realistic. But then it brought the same kind of improvements to the Garrard too. I did a lot of comparison shifting this tonearm between the 2 TTs. All my above comments about their differences holds true.
After about 2 weeks and multiple hours of comparison on all kinds of music, I decided that while there are areas where the Garrard lacks and Technics clearly shines, musically Garrard is more realistic whereas Technics is more cerebral. I knew I was going to miss that hi-rez sparkle from Technics but I could only keep one so it has to go. I sold the 1200G. But the curiosity still remained so I bought a Sp10 Mk2.
After there 1200G left my place, the Sp10 Mk2 arrived. I did not have a plinth but I had read on Audiogon that it can be used in the naked form with a suitable isolation like the Audio Technica AT-636 Pneumatic footers. I have those footers so I installed the Sp10 on those footers and used the 47 Labs tonearm with Denon 103r for listening.
In the first 10 secs it was clear the Sp10 Mk2 is a more dynamic player than the 1200G. It sounded more like a Garrard in terms of scale, dynamics and drive. At the same time it was more transparent than Garrard. I had read couple of opinions that the vintage Sp10 DDs has more torquey motor drive. Here I was clearly hearing that. If I enter the room, I would not know which player is playing simply because of the similarity in slam, dynamics and tonality. My Garrard has the audiosilente idler wheel, woodsong audio brake disc and kokomo bearings. It is also driven by a dedicated AC regenerator for a clean AC input. In effect it is a much cleaner and neutral TT than typical Garrards. The Sp10 Mk2 is a less romantic sounding TT overall but it does not feel "compact", "thin" or "bright". It sounds natural, which is a very important trait to enjoy music. It sounds big and punchy without sounding colored or veiled. I have not even installed the plinth yet. My Garrard is still the king in the system but the Sp10 is a good contender with higher resolution and lower noise floor overall.
Guys, I don't know how to put it. I am not here to spoil the party of the 1200G/GAE owners. It is definitely a very complete package. You get warranty, company support, spares and all the peace of mind with the new Technics DDs. But if you are one of those adventurous types deciding between the old school and new gen Technics TT, the old Sp10 mk2/mk3 wins it for me, purely from the sound quality perspective. New technology probably has given the new Technics a bit more refinement but the drive, excitement and immediacy of real instruments still is conveyed best by the grand old boys.
In SP 10 R proti starim napisal fant ki je testiral sl1200g vs sp 10 mk II ko so ga spraševali èe je mogoèe tudi to obdelal
I have not done it myself but I know couple of guys who have had the sp10r besides a sp10 Mk2/mk3.. Their opinion was that the older sp10 models present music with more drive and momentum whereas the the new 10r is more about sophistication and resolution. A more modern and laidback take on music that is.
So if you value more subtlety (belt drive style) and resolution then the 10r could appeal you more. For high energy, high drive, impactful listen the older sp10s does it better. |
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ambasador
Pridružen/-a: Sre Feb 2011 19:52 Prispevkov: 5984 Kraj: Izola
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Objavljeno: Čet Avg 16, 2018 09:19 Naslov sporočila: |
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... komu verjet ?
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svojim ušesom
Imaš prve informacije, potem sledijo druge, potem se poèasi ustvari splošno mnenje. Vmes so vedno tudi taki, ki so vedno proti zato da so vidni in oni drugi, ki so vedno za, da ne izpadejo štupidi...
V vsakem primeru se pridobi, èe drugo ne se cena vintiðu tako zniža. Pa prideš na svoj raèun s tolažbo, da neglede kaj je res, vsaj razlike niso enormne - ali paè?
Sam Technics je povedal svoje mnenje in primerjave. Nenazadnje bi jim bilo veliko lažje stari model dati v proizvodnjo, ne pa razvijati nekaj na novo in še narediti luknjo v vodi, flop. _________________ Carpe Diem |
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Ne, ne moreš dodajati novih tem v tem forumu Ne, ne moreš odgovarjati na teme v tem forumu Ne, ne moreš urejati svojih prispevkov v tem forumu Ne, ne moreš brisati svojih prispevkov v tem forumu Ne ne moreš glasovati v anketi v tem forumu
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